GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

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[NEO]Vortex
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GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

Post by [NEO]Vortex » Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:31 am

This is a long post, but I'd appreciate if everyone read it. I hope to thoroughly answer a lot of questions and respond to complaints I often have to put up with. This way, I won't have to constantly repeat myself in GSA and in-game.

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The list below consists of the most usual questions and complaints about the server, it's connection and lag in general.
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• "will GWD's live player stats return?"

We've decided not to bring those back, their 'cool factor' wore off relatively fast and weren't really worth the trouble.

• "hey i noticed the GWD server has been going down a lot..."

Yes, we're aware of the fact it has been. We would generally take it down to test certain things on that computer or to upgrade the components. We'd try to do this when no-one was playing and very few people were in the lobby. However, we're done with that now and the server should be up 24/7 again.

• "GWD's new ISP sucks!"

(Some of you may or may not know, the server was recently upgraded to a 30/5mb fiber-optic connection.)
No, the new connection has about six times as much bandwidth as Comcast's cable (the old ISP). Since it's a fios connection, the line's quality is a lot better as well. Everyone's pings dropped by 20-70ms even though the server remained in the same location.

• "GWD server lags!!!"

No, I play 3 or 4 times a week and the only people who seem to lag are laggers themselves. If your ping is spiking and everyone else's is stable, ever consider the fact it just might be you?

• "i dont lag when i host!!"

Idiot.

• "i dont lag my connection is <insert mediocre cable/DSL speeds here> this server sucks!!!"

Your connection isn't that great. Speed isn't everything, but if you want to think it is I can guarantee the server's connection is at least ten times faster than yours. Sorry, you lose. Also, 56kers usually have enough bandwidth to play the game just fine, but the line's latency is so terrible they ping insanely high to people located fairly close by.

• "ok its fast but it still must not have enough bandwidth to host for 10 players!!"

It always has, the old connection had 768kbit up. Giants servers tend to use, at a max, 4-6kBytes of upload per player. Convert 768kbits to kBytes (divide by 8) and you get 96kBytes, divide 96 by 6 and you get 16 (players). kBytes are generally what you see when downloading stuff off the net. However, some sites like FilePlanet display bits in an effort to trick users who do not understand the difference into thinking their service is better than the rest.

The new connection has 5mb of upload (5mb = 5,000kbit = 625kBytes). Let's say the server is full, (not gonna happen very often, but still) 6x20 = 120kBytes of upload required to host a 20 player game... if you've somehow already managed to forget, the server has 625.

I advise everyone to consider this formula when hosting, it should prevent twelve player lag-fests being hosted on 256kbit up.

• "ok... but it must be the computer its hosted on!!!"

Since most people in the Giants community think the P4 computers produced by Alienware are "godlike" I'm not even going to bother to tell you the server specs. Rest assured, however, it's more than capable of hosting for 20 players.

• "i was just playing with <player> earlier and i didnt lag!!"

Maybe not, but your connection may have a bad router along the way to the GWD server. When you connect to a server, the data you send has to 'hop' from 'routers' to reach it's destination. Basically, this means, the farther you are from the server, the more hops your connection must make to reach it's destination. Your ping, along with the chance to drop packets will be higher with the more hops your connection must make to connect.

If a 'router' your connection must 'hop' from is under heavy load at the time you're connecting, your ping may be higher than normal. Hence the name, "bad" router. These are usually fixed very soon, but I've seen them last from a day to a few weeks. This explains why people's pings tend to be 40-100 more than normal temporarily.

• "really? is there any way to fix bad routers?"

Unfortunately, there's nothing you can do but wait. Unless of course you're willing to gamble a chance to fix your route by getting a new ISP. To have the best connection possible before playing, please make sure of the following:

1) your computer doesn't have any spyware or viruses, programs running aren't using a lot of bandwidth.
2) you or other people on your network aren't downloading or uploading. If your connection is shared, make sure your brother downstairs isn't downloading, as this (usually) won't leave much bandwidth left for you to play. If this is a problem for you often, you may use a program such as Netlimiter to temporarily 'cap' the download or upload speed on the other computers in your network. When you close the program or disable the limits, they will be able to upload or download at their max speed as usual. You might want to tell them before doing this however, so they don't call your ISP complaining about slow speeds.

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This list consists of the most usual complaints about the server's administration. Just about every single one of these are direct quotations.
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• "you fuckers ban everyone!! mother fu**ing assholes!"

I wasn't aware of the fact that five or six people (three of which don't even play anymore) make up the entire Giants community. Most people who tell me this aren't banned, either.

• "you nazi mother fuckers ban people for no good reason!"

I guess cheating isn't a good enough reason? 90% of all bans are for cheating. Other bans are for those who lag insanely bad or constantly raid in TDM and break other rules (usually both). You do understand though, we run the server as a public service to you, and thus have the right to refuse said service to you at any time for any reason we wish. Oh, and despite what a few brilliant people think, we don't ban people because we don't get along with them - If we did Raving, Pookie, and Reuel would all be banned because we don't like them... As for Dragonheart, in addition to being an obstinate prick he was also a cheater. Go fig.

• "you should unban <person> they don't cheat anymore, i promise!!"

Maybe so, but sadly we've had a lot of people say this about others (LoL Angelights) and they always end up cheating again. We really can't be bothered to listen anymore.

• "mother fu**ing bullshit bans, fu**ing assholes banning me i didnt cheat!! it was my <friend or family member>!!"

You know what's funny? Just about everyone who cheats says this after we ban them. You know what's also funny? I don't believe you.
If it is the truth, however, I'm sorry about that but maybe you should go complain to whoever was using your computer at the time. Flaming me isn't going to make me decide to unban you.

[EDIT by Zofarks]
Having spent a great deal of time in the company of several Gamespy Arcade administrators, I can say with complete confidence that we're not the only people who have such a policy. While we do try to be fair to people in such cases (Falcoz and Dragonheart, for example) flaming us will not help matters.

• "you nazi mother fucker, kicking <player> for no good reason!!!"

People are kicked for nothing but good reasons. Calling me a nazi isn't going to make me apologize to them, either. Sorry, but we don't want to play with people who ping >500. If you want to, you can host or join their games. Have fun playing with client-side damage, though. Which is only one of the many annoyances of laggers. Incase you don't understand what that is, here's an explenation:

Giants uses client side damage, in a game there's two kinds of people: the server (host), and the client (players).

If a client is lagging a lot, generally the other player's movement doesn't update very often. Client side damage means, so long as you hit them on your screen, they'll take the damage eventually... even if they lag and the packets have to be resent over and over.

So let's say megacoolkid27 has 56k and pings 800, he's on the other team. It's defend the base and capture the smartie, you fly in his base, land in the comm and walk over to grab the flag. You get it, fly out and are on the way back to your base... you're about half way back to your base, then all of a sudden you're dead... hit by a direct mortar. Odd isn't it? He was probably lagging so bad you were just standing there in his comm center doing nothing on his screen, allowing him to mortar you with ease.

• "you're still horrible admins and have too many rules!!!"

You obviously don't play other games. Servers for other games tend to have 2-3 times as many rules and will instantly perma ban you for insulting an admin once or swearing. Get this, though, they will tend to WARN you for cheating. That's a horrible admin.

• "they warn people because they're good admins and don't want to ban people for mistakes."

They shouldn't need to warn people. It's common sense to not cheat in a game, whether it's a sport, board or computer game.

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In conclusion, if you think the server lags, or that we're unfair admins you can always play somewhere else.
Last edited by [NEO]Vortex on Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Zopharks
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Re: GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

Post by Zopharks » Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:16 am

TL;DR:
[NEO]Vortex wrote:In conclusion, if you think the server lags, or that we're unfair admins you can always play somewhere else.
Quoted for truth. Was probably all that really needed to be said, but longer posts are always fancier.

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King
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Post by King » Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:47 pm

Excellent post. I'll put a short blurb and link about this topic on the main page.

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|AFTA|Yankee
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Re: GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

Post by |AFTA|Yankee » Wed Nov 09, 2005 11:40 pm

Okay...a couple things....
A.)I totally agree with King, this is an excellent post and Vortex and Zopharx should give them selves a pat on the back!

B.)
[NEO]Vortex wrote:"i dont lag when i host!!"

Idiot.
Whoever said that should be taken out to the back of their house and be shot many, many times... : P

SSJBardock
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Re: GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

Post by SSJBardock » Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:18 pm

|AFTA|Yankee wrote: B.)
[NEO]Vortex wrote:"i dont lag when i host!!"

Idiot.
Whoever said that should be taken out to the back of their house and be shot many, many times... : P
Yes, because everybody who doesn't know everything about how the internet works does not deserve to live :?

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STEELIX
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Post by STEELIX » Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:38 pm

All that violence with kids these days...
Tsk, tsk, tsk.

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Re: GiantsWD.org Dedicated - I respond to recent criticisms

Post by |AFTA|Yankee » Sat Nov 12, 2005 6:06 pm

SSJBardock wrote:
|AFTA|Yankee wrote: B.)
[NEO]Vortex wrote:"i dont lag when i host!!"

Idiot.
Whoever said that should be taken out to the back of their house and be shot many, many times... : P
Yes, because everybody who doesn't know everything about how the internet works does not deserve to live :?

No, Because if ur talking about lag and tchnical stuff that goes along with it u probably know what ur talking about...and if not u shouldn't be talking about it in the first place...... :shock:

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Post by RichardMH » Wed Nov 16, 2005 8:31 pm

"i dont lag when i host!!"
lool, I like that one :P

anyhow

I would like to know why they even say some of the things and I also would like to know about this latency thingy.
My ISP upgraded my speed to 10mbit and when I download it starts at 2mb and goes down to 1,5mb or around that, why does it say it is 10mbit when I can only download at around 2?

[NEO]Vortex
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Post by [NEO]Vortex » Wed Nov 16, 2005 9:34 pm

I explained this in my first post. Your connection speed is being displayed in bits, but your download speed is in bytes. 8 bits = 1 byte

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RichardMH
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Post by RichardMH » Thu Nov 17, 2005 5:56 pm

oh, so 10mbit IS 1mbyte in download?

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Xentek
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Post by Xentek » Thu Nov 17, 2005 8:52 pm

10000kbit divided by 8 = 1250kbytes

So more or less 1mbyte, yes.

[NEO]Vortex
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Post by [NEO]Vortex » Sat Nov 19, 2005 4:55 pm

Most people divide by 9 or 10 to get their real speed, taking into consideration overhead and the like. If you're getting more than 1MB/s that's a really good speed for your line.

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RichardMH
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Post by RichardMH » Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:17 pm

well I use cablenut so I get like a boost ;)

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Post by Tasiin » Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:46 pm

Yes, because internet connection optimizer programs are so helpful.

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Zopharks
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Post by Zopharks » Wed Nov 23, 2005 10:03 pm

RichardMH wrote:well I use cablenut so I get like a boost ;)
"Boost" eh?

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